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if the John Winder b 1839 in your summary is this one

Births Dec 1839 (>99%)
Winder John Preston 21 567

you could discount it as (from Lancs bmd) mmn = Clayton

Lancashire Birth indexes for the years: 1839
Surname Forename(s) Sub-District Registers At Mother's Maiden Name
WINDER John Preston Preston CLAYTON

If William & Elizabeth Dewhurst married Preston 1836 and stayed in the Preston area there are 8 children (no William) born to a Winder with mmn = Dewhurst in Broughton, Preston

this thread keeps coming up at the top of 'my threads' as I input on abt p3. Have lost the plot since then but decided to join in again by printing it off.

A couple of pages ago it was asked which child could be the offspring of William Winder & Elizabeth Dewhurst

to eliminate
Emma b 1838 Preston mmn = Turnbull
Ruth b 1840- Preston mmn = Turnbull

also check of Wm married to Ellen Taylor age - age 19 on marriage on 22 Aug 1887 (as was Ellen Taylor)

Using 1871 as a starting point I am sorting the census information into family groups. Wild differences in dates of birth and also the names. Have excluded some Winder matches. Think I may need to include them because they become Winders in 1881. All names are born in Lancashire.

Will work through and fill in census details for each. Add additional families if you wish

Right now I need to go to bed. And unfortunately I will be AWOL tomorrow.

Oh by the way be my guest start on the 1861 census if you wish!!!



1871 - William 1844, bricklayer, Alice 1849, John William 1869, Alice 1870

1881 - William Alice John William Alice Frances Jessie Blanche




1871 – John 1841, coalminer, Elizabeth 1841, William 1865, Anna 1867, Elizabeth 1869

1881 – John 1835, Elizabeth 1845 William 1865 Mary E. 1871 Elizabeth 1875 John 1878



1871 – William b. ??? Colliery Lab, Jane 1824, William 1852 (coal) Mary 1853 (glass smoother),Ann J. 1855, Maria 1862, Lydia 1864, Jane 1870

And they are so neatly put to bed and all tied up in ribbon. Did you know I found Walter James, a son of James who married Hannah/Anna in Queensland Australia. And I have a great hope that I might have located a seedling on the same side of the family.

But I digress. I am looking at page 16 of the notes. Where Susan puts question marks all over the page and says she can not look at the original images. I am doing that.

This is revenge Sherlock
after kimberley carter green and Haggis.

I am going back over previous messages and contacts for clues.

The print out is now 36 pages long. At least if we lose the thread I will be able to send it to you. It is saved to file.

Oh that was clever, not. Really must sort my paperwork. I recycle old paper for print outs. Managed to get some of it back to front and now I have printing all over....... drats, back to the drawing board.

Keep wondering if the family name comes from the place name "Windres" - that is originally way way back.

Now I really do have to go.

I am back for a short time.

I have found the Windus derivation it is on the thread here somewhere. We keep saying there is a link between the families now we have to prove or disprove it.

Will put a list of what we need to know at the top of the summary.

I do not know. I looked at them because of their occupation

I seem to have a gap in records. Lancashire POC is still being updated. I have not found anything reliable on familysearch.
As I said before my dfinites are John and Ellen 1841 with two children but there could concievably be more left home before the census.
They are just not showing up with usual searches.

Possible variants are
windows
windres
windrus

Just looked at the image for the 1841 census George , father, and William son, aged 23. Both were bricklayers.

Do we assume they fit into your empire LK.

Hi Dea welcome and welcome Rhondda.

Reinforcements. Whoo hoo.

I wish I could work it so you could all edit the summary. The only way we can do it is if we discuss the bits to be added agree on it and then I edit the summary thread.

Unless you lot can come up with another suggestion.

Now I need to go for a while. If you work out things which need to be added EMPHASIZE THEM in some way on this thread and when I come back this afternoon I'll add them in.

Ladykira please confirm that you are comfortable with your tree and do not need bits added to it, well not at this stage. Dont want you to think you are missing out on the info.

The ones I have looked at today were added because of geography,occupation or something that caught my attention but I do not know where they fit in.

Rhondda has just joined so I am going to direct her here shortly as soon as we make contact.

WINDERS, George M 50 1791 Lancashire VIEW
WINDERS, Ann F 45 1796 Lancashire VIEW
WINDERS, William M 23 1818 Lancashire VIEW
WINDERS, Ann F 20 1821 Lancashire VIEW
WINDERS, John M 12 1829 Lancashire VIEW
WINDERS, James M 10 1831 Lancashire VIEW

This lot.

Was our William born in 1818 with father George and Mother Ann??

Their John son of William was born in 1829. Our John son of William was born in 1839. A certificate would be good.

NO That does not work. If William married in 1836 to Elizabeth Dewhurst, he would not be in the 1841 census at home. Will check image to see if he is a visitor.

That is what it needs Aunty Sherlock.

I have been wanting to help and have done done searching and found a few things but I have only been on in 'short bursts' over the past week or two and to be honest, although I have read through the thread a couple of times, I cannot keep up with what you are looking for.

A summary would really help those of us who have not been there since the beginning.

Dea x

I am going to do it. Going to start a duplicate thread with the summary on it. As we work out what fits I will transfer that info across to the duplicate thread.

I will label it duplicate thread and ask no one to post on it.

If the board police get their knickers in a knot I'll delete it.

1851 census - household transcription
Person: WINDERS, Ellen
Address: Moss Nook, Sutton


WINDERS, Henry Head Married M 27 1824 Engineer
Sutton
Lancashire VIEW
WINDERS, Elizabeth Wife Married F 28 1823
Sutton
Lancashire VIEW
WINDERS, Ellen Daughter F 2 1849
Parr
Lancashire

Marriage: 16 Jan 1814 All Saints, Rainford, Lancashire, England
George Winder - Bricklayer Bachelor of Of this Parish
Ann Holden - (X), Spinster of Of this Parish
Witness: Mary Winder; William Winder
Married by Banns by: William Ellam Minister
Register: Marriages 1813 - 1831, Page 10, Entry 29
Source: LDS Film 1657567

Marriage: 24 Oct 1808 St Mary the Virgin, Prescot, Lancashire, England
Thomas Winder - Brick layer bachelor of Parr
Ann Findley - spinster of St. Helens
Witness: Thos. Findley; Ralph Findley
Married by Licence by: Samuel Sewell, Vicar
Register: Marriages 1788 - 1812, Page 144, Entry 861
Source: LDS Film 1657584 item 10