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Derek's Derbyshire thread nudged for all the people looking for it

Thanks Derek we can have the dreaded Allens instead then. :-D. More nightmares methinks. I probably need your help with yet more of this family yet as they are prolific little breeders ;-).

Now I have taken a look carefully at what I have ,I agree the tree I looked at was not to be trusted methinks. I believe he is the son of Francis(Frank) and Mary Chamberlain, not 100% sure though. :-S

Thank you so much again Derek,looks like i'm as far back as i can go with those families.I think i might start going forward with them now lol.Once again Thank you :-)

Hi Gooner........this could be difficult.......there are a number of conflicting findings here.............what is for sure is that HENRY ALLEN Church \Broughton 1828 is on the 1851 census..married to Eliza from Bromshill Staffordshire 1849..with one child Richard Allen born 1851.

I know that this Eliza from Bromshill is in fact ELIZA MILNER..........but I have two possibles for parents of Henry..one is your old mate FRANCIS ALLEN of Church Broughton to his first wife Mary Chamberlain married 1829.........Francis' parents are Thomas Allen and lucy Walters.......but this is from a tree on Ancestry which looks a right mess........which showa henry as having been born in longton Staffs.......let me know your thoughts on this..because I smell trouble of Measham proportions!!

Derek.

Hi Derek, hope you are both ok. Please can you see if you can find a marriage for me.

Henry Allen born 1828 Church Broughton married Eliza( Milner ?? ) on one census I have him with a stepson called Thomas Lewis. ?? . There first child of the marriage was born 1850 Uttoxeter. Thank you

edit... I think I might have the wrong Henry he may well have married Ann not Eliza.

Hi Derek,

Thank you. Once again you come up with the goods. I'm pleased I'm not one to simply copy someones tree, the one on Ancestry is obviously wrong.

Warm regards

Chrissie

Hello Jeanette..sorry for the delay..but have got into all sorts of troube eith Sarah A Coupe.........truth is she was baptised in Bolsover derbys..31.08.1834.............but she was illegitimate..with a mother simply detailed as Mary.......and although I have oat other times researched successfully the Coupes.......I can find no link stron enough to pass on to you.......I have some firm ideas..but not good enough to adorn your excellent tree.......I have a marriage for 4thQtr 1855 at Mansfield..civil registration to George Green which sort of reinforces her illegitimacy.and the unlikelihood in those days of her being able to marry in Church..hence no Parish record of the marriage.

As for the Greens..I see again that you have got almost everything already....excpet that I can tell you that John Green born Worksop 1806 married Mary CHADWICK of Cresswell on 11.10.1829 at Cuckney Notts...I see you have their children..but if you want to add the following to your tree I have their Christening details:-

ELIZABETH born 1831.baptised Cuckney 02.09.1832
ELIZA baptised Cuckney 08.12.1833 (not 100% on this)
GEORGE bapt.24.08.1834
HANNAH baptised Warsop 27.08.1837
JOHN bapt Warsop 02.06.1839
MARY bapt Warsop 31.10.1841

and on the 1851 Census there is also a HENRY born 1847 Warsop..who i cannot find.

I think that's about all i can do for you, because the forebears of John Green and of Mary Chadwick have serveral possibilities and would be guesswork.

All the best

Derek.

hello again Chrissie....difficult one.....I can tell you that Samuel Tomlinson was born 1846 and he was the son of Richard and Elizabeth.....but not Elizabeth Lees...........

If you bear with me I'll tell you why.

RICHARD TOMLINSON of Darley married ELIZABETH LEES at Beeley 21.04.1834..they had at least two children baptised at Beeley..and appear with their family on both 1841 and 1851 censuses.

SAMUEL TOMLINSON son of Richard and Elizabeth appears also on the 1851 census..as well as others.....Richard his father is from Nottingham and elizabeth is from Carsington......they were married a Duffield..the parish of which belper is part..03.03.1828..and her maifen name was Taylor
...Samuel was the fifth of six children......none of which tie up with the
other family.......I'm not entirely sure about Elizabeth Taylor at this moment because i cannot find her at Carsington...but its a start.

BIG EDIT!!!!!..Elizabeth Taylor born Carsington 20.12.1808..baptised 31.01.1809..daughter of Samuel and Rebekah..married Richard tomlinson at duffield (Belper) 03.03.1828..........They had SEVEN children (not six)..of which Samuel was second last...........NONE of them have any baptismal record in any data i can find......which means they remained unbaptised (unlikely)..or were baptised en masse after 1850....very possible..but not likely....or they were non-conformist.

I would have to go to Matlock to find out..I'm now going to take a look at richard's background.

see you soon !

Derek.

Hi Derek,

Need your help again please.

Do you have any records for Belper. I'm hoping you can find the baptism of Samuel Tomlinson c1847. On his marriage certificate his father was named as Richard, a stockinger. A tree on Ancestry has Samuels parents as Richard Tomlinson and Elizabeth Lees.

On Freebmd there are two births in Belper in 1845, but going by his marriage certificate his year of birth was 1846/7.

Hope you are well

Chrissie

Thanks Derek, I had not a clue who her parents were so no help there. I am having loads of trouble tracing their offspring. They all seem to disappear on 1891 census'

Hi Derek, all previous info logged .....am now ready for all you've got on sarah coupe lol cheers
jeanette :-D

Hey LA...trouble ahead...........

FRANCIS ALLEN married ELIZA BULL 05.02.1860 St Werbergh Derby

Ditto married ditto 29.01.1860 Sutton on the Hill

Ditto squared married Ditto squared All Saints derby 20.02.1860......in this case her father is named as Joseph......

which puts any chance of finding her heritage into the realms of fantasy!!

unless you know better!!

p.s i do have a lot of BULL baptisms from Sutton.

Derek.

Yes isn't Robin doing us proud :-D.

Thanks for this info every little helps x

Hi Gooner......VanP strikes again eh??....had a quick look,,FRANCIS ALLEN of Church broughton married ELIZA BULL of Suton on the Hill..at ALL SAINTS DERBY (not Church Brougton)..20.02.1860

Francis appears to have been born 1840son of Samuel and mary.....I say seems to have been......becasue i'm not sure...

The first two children Mary A 1861 and Albert 1864 were born at Church Broughton

Thirza..or theresa 1866..born at Sutton on the Hill

then there seems to have been a gap becasue the 1881 Census has Annie 1877..Florence 1879 and Thomas 1880..all having been born in Sheffield..where the family were living at 19 Cherrytree Yard Sheffield........nothing better to report at the moment...........

Derek.

Hi Derek, hope you are well.

I have Francis Allen married to Eliza Bull. Married 1860 Church Broughton ?. My problem is I cannot find the birth dates of their children Florence and Thomas. I believe there were only another 4 children who are Mary A 1861,Albert 1864,Thirza 1866 and Annie E 1877. can you check these for me please and see if there are anymore offspring.

Thank You

Nope..you're right..that's the 1841 census...........But i use Ancestry.co.uk.i find it more reliable..
More tomorrow

Derek.

wellll what about this lol. i got this from fmp and i wonder if George 1806 could be joseph 1816 s brother and williams half brother? what do you think? or have i got the wrong ones .lol

WHITE, Luke M 75 1766 Derbyshire
WHITE, George M 35 1806 Derbyshire
WHITE, William M 13 1828
WHITE, Joseph M 25 1816 Derbyshire
WHITE, Sarah F 25 1816 Derbyshire
WHITE, Joseph M 2 1839 Derbyshire

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Piece:
195 Book/Folio:
7/28 Page:
17 Registration District:
Chesterfield

Civil Parish:
Eckington Municipal Borough:
Address:
Eckington, Eckington County:
Derbyshire

You may not get any more goss tonight..Sarah Coupe or not!!! lol

Wow........thank you sooo much, you are wonderful..i'm going to go and process all of the above now,..could be a while.... :-)

Jeanette


'n' then i will be back for all the goss on sarah coupe lol

Ok Jeanette..here we go with some hot of the Press stuff on Hannah Maria WHITE.

You have Joseph White's wife as SARAH LEE.........WRONG!!,,Sorry,.He says with some glee)

JOSEPH WHITE married SARAH STOR(E)Y at Eckington 13.06.1836..the trick is that she is well-documented as coming from Mosborough.(born 1815)
Sarah Lee of Eckington married Thomas Taylor 08.06.1835

Joseph and Sarah White had the following children:-

Joseph A 1840
Sarah Jane 25.06.1848
Mary Ellen 19.05.1850..sadly died 20.07.1852
Elizabeth 03.07.1852
HANNAH MARIA 22.10.1854
Emma Lilian 19.07.1857....(.exact dates are baptisms not birthdays)

JOSEPH WHITE was born 27.12.1813 baptised 06.02.1814
son of :-
Luke White(baptised 03.08.1766) and Frances nee Armitage baptised 25.06.1769.........who were married 15.05.1787.....witnesses George White and William Armitage..Luke's Brother and Frances' father.

Interestingly Luke is still around on the 1841 Census as widower and head of household.
I don't have the elder children of Luke and Frances..but Joseph 1813 was the youngest..

Another interesting entry on the 1841 Census below Joseph,Sarah and joseph A..is one WILLIAM WHite aged 13..........further digging reveals that William born 1828 was the son of Luke and Margaret...which means that Luke White married twice and was widowed twice...Joseph 1813 and William 1828 are therefore half-brothers.

LUKE WHITE 03.08.1766 was the son of Joseph White and Hannah Haslehurst who married at Eckington 06.02.1758

FRANCIS ARMITAGE was baptised 25.06.1769..son of William Armitage baptised 15.04.1745..who in turn was son of William Armitage baptised 12.07.1708..

I don't at the moment have the marriage for either William...but this all happened at Eckington.....
worth waiting for??? lol

Derek.