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Hi Derek

Sent you a message a few days ago and now realise I should have posted it on this thread instead. Am quite new to this and was not sure how it works.

You were kind enough to help with the GREATOREX entries in Shirley. I was looking for info about Sarah Greatorex born 1825.

Are there any details of the fathers of Sarah's two illegitimate children, Thomas 1850 and Susannah 1853 or am I correct in assuming they were baptised as "Greatorex" with father unknown !

Sarah's father, William who was also putting it about, had a "liaison" with Brenda, are there any details of a marriage or death for Brenda before William married Hannah.

This branch of my family never fails to surprise me its a wonder I am not completely off the rails !!

Any additional details would be really helpful.

Thanks Susan

:-D :-D :-D <3

Ha bleedin' Ha.............xx

I am busy working on the Wiltshire branch at the moment Derek. Thought I'd give you a little rest :-D. Well you can always look for those Meashams :-| :-D :-D :-D <3

Thanks Derek. Speak soon.
Verna:)

Hello Gooner..how nice!!xx......If you read anything of my Canadian Thread..you'll be delighted to hear that our dear friend Sylvia has come up trumps.and has Pulled in Janey (Canuck) to look at local records..I'm fairly sure that I have found the right family in ontario Canada....

It's about time you gave me some work to do!! I'm off to Matlock in the next two weeks.

Take care .

Derek.

Morning Derek <3

Hi Verna......he best I can do is a William Brown birth "about" 1678..no other details..a marriage to Lucie Haniford..date correct..birth of Paul..date corect........another Paul born and died 09.03.1701..son of William and Lucie.

I think you're doing very well getting anything from that far back..most Parish records were almost unreadbale at that time...and I've see a few!!

Derek.

Oh dear....yes.... that doesn't make any sense at all, sorry,

I obviously can't read my notes and write at the same time. I'll start again. William Brown married Lucy (Hanford) in Eastwood - 13.06.1698. I'm looking for their birthdates and parents if possible.

These two had a son Paul born 24.01.1713.
I think I've got that right.
Verna :-D

Daer Verna..please look at the dates you have given me!!

Derek

Hi Derek,
It's Verna again.....don't know if you can help with William Brown born 24.01.1713 (he was a blacksmith) married Lucy (possibly Hanford) in 1698. They had at least one child, Paul, born in 1713. I'm looking for info on William's & Lucy's parents. All born, lived, died and buried in Eastwood, I believe.
Thanks :-)

Hi Warwick..Agnes almost certainly was not baptised...you may have noticed that her death registration in Shardlow shows birth in 1890.......certsinly iin infancy....

derek.

Hello again Derek,
Agnes Olive. Death registered at Shardlow 3rd Qtr 1890 - right on cue.
I cannot find any reference to her birth though - any thoughts?
Annie was a devout Church attendee so I'm hoping their was a baptism which we can trace when the new incumbent arrives.
Warwick

Hi Derek,
I can vouch for Alice's integrity, she was just one of life's unfortunate -always in the wrong place at the wrong time to have her place in history recorded! She was my Great Aunt, married Thomas Holloway and had nine children, some of whom are still around.
Instead of posting from an ailing memory I should have had the 1911 visible then I could have dealt with the Granchildren Red Herring.
They were Edith's, she was still single and living at home eventually marrying their father about five years later.
James & Annie were my Paternal G.grandparents. I have completed his biography from cradle to grave. They appear in every census from 1861 to 1911 with the exception of 1891.
This would have been Alice's first chance to appear, age 4, at 14 1901 she was visiting her Maternal Grandfather back in Whittington, at 24 1911 she was in service with James Eady, then she married later that year.
She was the most difficult to trace.
I still think the missing child was born in the gap between Annie and my grandfather William, after all great grannie popped them out at regular and fairly precise intervals! If they suffered an infant death in 1891 this would perhaps explain why James missed the census, particularly as his Father a few doors away managed to complete his form.
Sandiacre is getting a new vicar at Easter, so I'm hoping my Uncle will be able to trawl through the remaining records in the rectory.
Sorry to have steered you of course with too little information.
The birth and death should have been recorded at Shardlow, if it was a still birth I don't think it would count for the census, or am I wrong?
Warwick

Hello Warwick.....I have accounted for all the children you mention in 1901..with the exception of Alice 1889.........but in 1901 she is living with the Holland family..clearly her mother.....

The 1911 has two young children born since 1901...no indication of their parents.........one thing you may consider..the 1911 census form does indeed say one living one dead........don't take this too seriously because the form only gives the two options living or dead..it does not account for the fact that the"missing" child might be Alice.

On the other hand it could mean that,because there appears to be a six year gap between the two grandchildren..there may be one missing..or it could be an as yet untraced child of James and Annie who was there parents....but that would have to be a child of around the age of Nellie or Annie.or maybe just Alice....maybe the reason that Alice is living elsewhere in 1911 is that the grandchildren are Alice's.....perhaps Illegitmiately...becasue in 1901 she is still single......

Loads of questions, only to be answered by finding the parents of the two grandchildren.......adn for that you'll need the Birth certificate...

I'll keep looking..

Derek.

Hi Derek,
James Beresford Belfitt (1859 Chesterfield) married Annie Holland (1863 Norton) in 1883.
Children
Edith 1883 New Whittington
Nellie 1885 Ditto
Alice 1886 Ditto
Annie 1888 Sandiacre
William 1892 Ditto
Lizzie 1894 Stapleford
Hilda 1896 Ditto
The 1911 census has 8 children 7 living 1 dead
Now the easy bit - All I need from you is the name of the dead one of unknown sex/D.o.B/Name.
I know you said you weren't too hot on deaths.
I'm guessing it was between Annie & William probably 1890 in Sandiacre.
Yes I Know some of their records were burnt - every church I try has the same problem!! NOTHING TO DO WITH ME.
Thanks
Warwick

Hi Derek
I have been in touch by PM with LAGooner, who has kindly provided me with the answers to my Meakin query, so no need for you to go to any trouble
Many thanks
Jim

Hello Susan.thanks for your PM.......am pleased to offer you the GREATOREX entries on the Shirley Parish Records........pretty much as an introductory measure::-

BAPTISMS:-

George baptised 10.10.1793
Sarah baptised 10.10.1793 (born 21.05 1791)

both children of William and Barbara,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

William 18.07.1813
Joseph 19.110.1817
SARAH 09.04.1826 (born 11.10.1825)

Now this bit is intersting, and needs a clear head......two children born to SARAH GREATOREX (illegitimately:-

Susanna 19.04 1853..and Thomas born 25.05.1850 baptised 11.04.1852................could this be the same Sarah Greatorex who married GEORGE FEARN 04.09.1856 ?????
(I have ways of checking this out)

MARRIAGES (in addition to that of Sarah to George)

Charlotte married Robert Dale 26.09.1805
JOSEPH..son of Willam and \hannah) married Elizabeth Sellers 21.07.1840
Mary..married Thurston Dale 08.09.1806
WILLIAM GREATOREX married HANNAH THACKER 06.02.1811
John married Ann Middleton 29.0.1716

There are a couple of things that will either confuse you or provide information in addition to what you already have........

Neither William not Hannah Thacker were born in Shirley..but a couple Burials at Shirley lead us to Ashbourne and/or Osmaston.......which i can check out.

HANNAH GREATOREX buried Shirley 18.06.186 aged 80
WILLIAM GREATOREX buried Shirley 18.07.1843 ages 73........will get back to you on both of these....

and another anomaly........we have:-

George Greatorex born 15.07.1793 baptised 05.10.1795
Sarah Greatorex born 21.05.1791............both children of William....so if youy look back to the children of William and Barbara..you'll see the same Sarah 21.05.1791....baptised 10.10.1793.........so William senior seems to have been spreading it around a bit before he married Barbara..just as Sarah seems to have been doing before she married George Fearn.

Just as easily we could interpret this as william being married to barbara before he married hannah......

don't get confused just reject what doesn't fit..this is simply information taken from the Shirley parish records.......it's up to you to interpret it

Back with more later

Derek.

Many thanks Derek...most kind as always :-)

Funnily enough it is exactly 3 years to the day (well with this posting) when I last contacted you on another of your threads... about Joseph Badder b c1800 Ashbourne :-D...and I am still looking...forever hopeful! Joseph moved to Stockport, Cheshire in the early 1840s and died there in 1861.

The new familysearch site has given me a glimmer of hope with the possible Bradley connection...also with further Badder baptisms using the batch number...these records were not shown on IGI. Having googled Bradley I found it came under Ashbourne :-)

Many thanks again and appreciative of any help....keep warm!

Linda

Hello Linda.I'm afraid i don't have the PR's for Bradley..have found the three children you mention..including a baptism date for Elizabeth 28.08.1796..........Joseph appears to be the onlly one still alive in 1841..though Elizabeth could be under her married name.

I am going to Matlock records office as soon as the snow clears....if it does!!..and will look at the originals for you.

Sorry not be more helpful.

Derek.