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Hi Derek,

I never take anything that I see on any trees as fact especially on A****y as there are some real doozies out there ....

I found one today with a Pakeman connection that had the father born 102 years before his supposed son ! I know that they breed 'em strong int' country but thats an awful lot of viagra :-D :-D :-D :-D

I look forward to hearing what you think about the Carsingtonbranch of the Pakeman family query.

Thanks once again

Barbara

Hi Derek,
I have found a William Bancroft marrying a Charlotte Nadire in Spondon in 1801..... but unless he died at the altar on their wedding day it seems unlikely that my Charlotte would have remarried in the same year ... I will keeping looking ...
Anne :-)

Hi Barbara...do not ever accept as fact what you see on Ancestry trees....they are a mess..at best badly researched..at worst downright dishonest..and my other hobby is tearing holes in those that have quite obviously been copied or stolen...

I was..and still am quite happy that your Pakemans..came from Sutton on the Hill..and that you are causing yourself pain by even considering the Ann Siddull marriage...9Neither of them came from Darley!..possibly Tutbury).....can't prove it yet..but I will!!

Derek.

Hello monica...you're right about Catholic records..they are very hard to find because the Catholic churches tended to hang on to their own records and not publish them..........this all changed in 1837 when Civil registration came in......Some \catholic records are available, but very hit and miss.

There appears to be no George Ross born in Derbyshire or Staffordshire...strange but true.

I think you're right about him being Catholic..who else but a Catholic would baptise his children in that Faith..............I believe his wife was Sarah???

Why was he born in Chesterfield??..to find that out we'd have to find his parents and their movements prior to 1795..which I'm afraid may not be possible.

I'll see if i can find if they have Catholic records at matlock records Office.

Derek.

Hi Derek
I am looking for the birth or baptism of George Ross, born approx 1798, birth place listed as Chesterfield on censuses from 1841-81, he lived in Bloxwich and Blakenhall, Staffordshire. Records from St Mary and all Saints and surrounding area churches have been searched from 1795-1805, with no result, he may have been Catholic as his children were baptised in the RC church in Bloxwich, I have been told that it is unlikely that any Catholic records are available from this time? I have also wondered whether he just happened to be born in Derbyshire for some reason, maybe the family was traveling, and he was baptised in Staffordshire?

Hi Derek,

Your memory is spot on !! Yes I did query another of the Pakemans of Sutton on the Hill :-) :-) :-)

However - I have one Francis left over that I cannot for the life of me match to a branch of the SOTH families. On A*****y I came across a tree that sort of matches some of my info but I think they have crossed 2 lines and matched my G G/mother to incorrect parents. If I can confirm my theory (or as close as can be done) then I will know that all my hours of research at Lichfield RO have not been in vain.

If not I'm going to need a very long lie down in a darkened room - possibly with one of the little white jackets with all the snazzy ties at the back ??? :-S :-S :-S

The A****y details are William Pakeman bn c 1775 married Ann Sudale bn c 1766 in 1796 at St Alkmunds, Derby. (IGI shows her name as Ann SUDALL ) FreeReg shows both of the parish of Darley. This is the query. Darley is a far enough distance away from SOTH and I think that the parentage has been crossed and my relative is not descended from this marriage. If I can confirm Williams parents that would clinch it.

There is also a further query on the same lines (same tree as well - heaven help us!!)

Francis Pakeman bn c 1802 married Ann Slack bn c 1803 at Middleton Derbys. They married at Bassington (??) in 1825) She of Bassington he of Carsington parishes. Now I know that there was a line of Pakemans at Carsington that were miners. Bit of leap I would think for one of the sons to jump on his horse (if he had one) ride all the way to SOTH, become a farmer, then jump back on his horse to marry Ann at Bassington ....... even if he was desperate to have his wicked way with her :-D

I hope this clears the muddy waters a little. I need a cup of tea now !

Thanks Derek

Barbara

Barbara,am looking into this for you..haven't we been here before?? and weren't the family from Sutton on the Hill??..as i rememebr one of their children was Francis??..could be wrong..remind me!!

Derek.

Thanks again Gins....have sent her a message on her Thread..one of many that are piling up!!!

Derek.

Hello Derek,

When you have a spare moment could you have a look at your parish records to see if you have any information on the following marriage please ??

William PAKEMAN married Ann SUDALE or SUDALL at St Alkmunds Derby in 1795. Both parish's for groom and bride are noted on FreeReg as Darley.

Ann Sudale was born c 1766 (??) and William Pakeman c 1775 (???) .... is there any info on their parents or where they were born ??

I am trying to tie up some loose threads on my Pakeman branch, but seem to have one to many male Pakemans that I can't match to any branch so far.

Thank you very much.

Barbara

Sent you another Derek!


http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/boards/board/ancestors/thread/1321596

x

Hi Derek.......

You were recently able to confirm the marriage between John CASHMORE and Elizabeth WARD at Smisby on Smisby 17 September 1816 for me.......Could you check and see if there are any details of either sets of parents or where the bride and groom come from.

Many Thanks
Susan :-)

Hi Derek,

Good idea! .... I have trawled the Phillimores but can't find any Charlotte marrying a Bancroft at the right time in Derbyshire :-(

On the LDS I have found 3 children baptised in West Hallam:
Martha c1793
Catherine c1790
William c1793
And their mother is a Charlotte Bancroft ..... but there is no mention of a father.

I also found a Chollotte Bancroft c 12 Oct 1781 in Wilne - parents William and Mary Bancroft?

Ooh another Edward and Sarah! Nice one! .... but they were married in 1753 so either they waited a long time to have kids or George was really getting on a bit when he was baptised! :-D (Or am I missing something obvious? - I often do!)

I am still trying to work out William Ridgard (c1831) and his son Fred W. I can't find a marriage for the widow Ann.

I don't like these Ridgard/Braddow/Bancroft puzzles! They are a pain in the whatsit! :-| My other family branches have been nowhere near this trouble!

Ho Hum .... off I go with my spade......

Anne :-)

Edward Bradday married Sarah Elton 16.10.1753.at Morley?????

Derek.

Hello Anne..just a suggestion..since the bancrofts appear to be very well documented at West Hallam..and we cannot find Charlotte........I have an idea!!..should we be looking for a male Bancroft that married a Charlotte......maiden name unknown..on the basis that Charlotte Bancroft's marriage was her second marriage????????????

Derek.

Hi Derek,

So .... it looks like George and Alice Braddow's son Edward (c1723 Stanley) is probably not my George's (c1775 Stanley) father after all. And Edward's wife Sarah definitely could not have been his mother as she died before he was born.

Unless ........ Edward remarried and his new wife was also called Sarah? But that would make him about 52 years old when my George was baptised .... a bit old .... and most people in those days were baptised in infancy weren't they so maybe unlikely he was baptised as an adult ..... I think you may very well be correct in that we have a generation missing.

I know that I have a notebook somewhere with loads of Braddows from Stanley written in it. I will have another search of my cupboards for it this afternoon.

Many thanks for all of your help.

Anne :-)

HiAnne..infact Edward braddow WAS baptised inStanley along with all the rest.....here is the full list from Stanley Bishop's Transcripts:-

Children of George and Alice Braddow:-

Mary (Bradday!) 05.03.1718
George 09.02.1720
Edward 24.11.1723 (at Stanley)
John (Bradder!) 26.10.1725
Samuel 19.01.1730
Sarah 18.09.1733
William17.05.1737..buried 28.12.1737..his mother Alice buried 18.06.1737

Looks like a tragedy o one child too many!!

We have a possible problem with Edward and Sarah..if edward married Srah Uton 1765...then the birth of george son of edward and sarah 09.01.1775 is possible........

But we have a Edward. b 1723..married to a Sarah and having the ollowing children:-

Alice 30.10.1748
Hannah 14.04.1751
Ann 05.02.1753..buried 12.05.1753..and mother SARAH BURIED 15.05.1754.......clearly not the mother of George 1775.........there is a generation missing somewhere..because it is also unlkely that Edward son of George and Alice 1723 is his father..........in 1775...

Other Braddows from Stanley

Edward \Braddow born 29.07.1802 baptised 14.08.1802 son of george and Rebecca.....

Ellen Braddow daughter of George and Mary baptised 24.04.1757..married henry Harper 07.03.1786 at Stanley by banns....their first child henry baptised 06.08.1786.................

I have the Spondon registers laso..i'll now go and give them a going over...
EDIT........Ann Braddow's marrieage to Seth Bamford 13.11.1794..was witnessed by George braddow..but George Braddow along with William Scattergood wotnessed loads of marriages!!

Ann Braddow 28.09.1766 is listed as "spurious" daughter of edward and Sarah......and I supoose George Braddow could be a lot older than we think nad have been baptised in 1775 as an adult?????



Derek..

Hi Derek,

Just found some old notes .... I have George (c1775 Stanley) Braddow's father as Edward Bradder (also Bradow) who married Sarah Ufton on 8th October 1765 at St Werburgh's in Spondon.

If these are the correct parents then George had a sister - Ann Braddow c 28 Sept 1766 in Stanley. I think she married a Seth Bamford of Breadsall on 13 Nov 1794 in Stanley.

My scribbles show that Edward Braddow's parents might have been George and Alice Bradday of Stanley and that they had 4 boys (George 1720, Edward 1723, Samuel 1730, William 1737) and a girl (Mary 1718). The only problem I have is that all the children except Edward were christened in Stanley. Edward was christened in West Hallam. But it is only next door I suppose!

BUT I also found an Edward and Sarah Braddow of Stanley who had Alice (1748), Hannah (1751), Ann (1753). So not absolutely sure which Edward is George and Alice's lad. Unless it is the same Edward - and poor old Sarah had 27 years of childbearing! :-0

I have also found lots of Bancrofts living in West Hallam beginning in 1671 right through the 1700s and 1800s but I still can't link any of them to Charlotte.

I will keep digging!

Anne :-)

Hello Derek
Wondered if you had anything on the 2 Slater families I asked about - -27 February and 5 March you seem to be able to solve lots of problems
Thank you
Pat

My great great great grandfather Peter Gould was born on Stanton in the Peak near Youlgrave in 1811. He married Sarah Gregory whose family had Stanton Farm as tenant farmers.
In 1841 Peter was "unlawfully slayed by George Gregory"according to the coroner (as detailed on death certificate). At his trial in Derby George Gregory was aquitted with a fine of 1s. after changing his plea to guilty. Sarah Gregory was the only witness and she identified George Gregory as Peter's killer.
i have searched newspapers unsuccessfully(only finding results of trial), can anyone suggest another way to discover the full story. I am aware that at the time, previous good character was an indication of innocence. :-)

Hi Derek, The WIDOW Ann Ridgard?! :-0 I didn't know about that. She couldn't have been William's wife tho as William married a Harriet and had more children didn't he? Anne.