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Sorry forgot to add the witnesses
Henry Mark weatherhead, who was my Mother's Father.
William henry Kennard, I have no idea who this is.

I apologise Christine for not making the search easier I am so thankful to all of the people trying to help me.
Details of Mum and Dad's wedding certificate are as follows.
Married at St. John's Church in Celsea London.
27nd May 1928.
Patrick James Ryan. aged 27 Batchelor, painter, 35a Tetcott Road Chelsea.London.
Father's name Patrick, coach builder.
May Florence Ryan. aged 19 spinster, domestic servant, 30 Tetcott road, Chelsea, London.
Father's name Henry Mark weatherhead, hall porter.
they signed the wedding certificate
Patrick james Ryan.
May Florence Ryan.

I have received an email from my brother saying he remembers Dad saying he was from County Cork.

I have searched 1911 census until I am blue in the face, trying every possible combination of Patrick/James/Ryan/Gwen/Raymond names, but can't find anything. I have checked the whole of Sand Street too, no clues. I have looked for coach builders called Patrick and all its variations ... nothing.

Patricia, I'm sure I'm not the only one who is finding it hard to extract hard facts from your posts. Would it be possible for you to copy onto this thread - without any added in "I seem to remember ..." bits - EXACTLY what is written on each of the certificates you have? I think our best chance of finding the truth (if indeed it exists) is from the marriage certificate, which you KNOW to be correct. Even the names of the witnesses could give some kind of clue.

The only Gwenllian Raymond I can find is with hubby "Benjamin"
And way back in 1881 too.
So not the same oneas the 1896 poss marriage.

And the groom John Mcclarney shouldnt be there on that 1896 list as he is in the wrong place?

Geez,Viv,
I don't know!! It's the most interesting one I've seen so far,though.

Maureen

What do you think ladies??

Marriages Jun 1896 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

>>>>>>>Evans Gwenllian Merthyr T. 11a 935
JONES Anne Elizabeth Merthyr T. 11a 935
McClarney John Cardiff 11a 935
Morgan Charles Merthyr T. 11a 935
>>>>>>Raymond Patrick Merthyr T. 11a 935

Deaths Jun 1935 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ryan Patrick R 68 E.Glamorgan 11a 895

1901


OWENS, Margaret
OWENS, C A
OWENS, F J
OWENS, Thomas
DAVIES, Sarah


Address:
55, Sand Street, Merthyr Tydfil, Dowlais

Just in case anyone wants to look around the neighbourhood:

1901 Census
55, Sand Street, Merthyr Tydfil, Dowlais
Merthyr Tydfil, Glamorganshire
RG13 piece 5029 folio 65 page 27

1901 census transcription details for: 52, Sand Street, Merthyr Tydfil, Dowlais
National Archive Reference:
RG number: RG13 Piece: 5029 Folio: 65 Page: 27

Reg. District: Merthyr Tydfil Sub District: Upper Merthyr Tydfil
Parish: Merthyr Tydfil Enum. District: 10
Ecclesiastical District: St John Dowlais City/Municipal Borough:
Address: 52, Sand Street, Merthyr Tydfil, Dowlais County: Glamorganshire
DAVIES, Alfred Head Married M 33 1868
Dowlais
Glamorganshire
DAVIES, Sarah J Wife Married F 30 1871
Dowlais
Glamorganshire
DAVIES, Thomas P Son Single M 9 1892
Dowlais
Glamorganshire
DAVIES, Edwin Son Single M 3 1898
Dowlais
Glamorganshire
DAVIES, Eliza J Daughter Single F 12 1889
Dowlais
Glamorganshire
JONES, Elizabeth Mother-In-Law Widow F 49 1852
Dowlais
Glamorganshire
JONES, Susan Sister-In-Law Single F 20 1881 Tempering In Brickyd
Dowlais
Glamorganshire
JONES, Elizabeth A Sister-In-Law Single F 13 1888


And what was Patrick's occupation on the birth cert???

Maureen

This birth certificate I have names him as James, born 15th May 1900, his father's name Patrick ryan, his Mother's name is Gwenllian Ryan formally Evans.
He was born at 55 Sand Street, Dowlais Glam.
The person who registered the bath was S.J. Davies 52 Sand Street.

I also found in my Dads wallet a newspaper cutting saying a Patrick raymond Ryan aged 68 had died septicaemia and he lived at 68 Gray Street Canton Cardiff.
This was in1933.

Just to add I think Patrick James Father was called Patrick Raymond and his Mother was Gwenillian Evans, I'm not 100% sure of this.
Patrick James definitely had two sisters named Nellie and Vera.

And on the birth cert that you found what does it say his parents names are please?
Also the fathers occupation and their address,so that maybe it can be investigated to see what comes up about it.

Both my Mum and Dad were living in Chelsea when they married.
But the birth certificate which I found in my Dad's belongings says cardiff in Wales to make matters more complicated my Dad mentioned he came from Cork.
I'm not sure if this is my memory playing teicks and he was saying his Dad came from Cork.

I'm assuming we are, Maureen (though goodness knows why when you're in NY and I'm in France!) and there are two matches on the 1911 census for a father named Patrick along with a son also named Patrick and born in about 1901. Neither is listed as Patrick James, neither father is a coach builder - so we really need Patricia to tell us where we are meant to be looking!

Probably??

Marriages Jun 1928 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ryan Patrick J Weatherhead Chelsea 1a 932


There is a Ryan/weatherhead birth to suit the poster in that area later on

Are we in England for this???

Maureen

Patricia - where was the family living at the time of the marriage certificate?

Thankyou to everyone who has replied.
I can't be sure when he was born as the birth certificate contredicts what he told us.
On my Mum and Dad's wedding certificate the information is the year they were married is 1928 and his age is 27 he is down as Patrick James Ryan and his Father is Patrick ryan and he was a coach builder.

If you would like to give his year of birth place of birth and fathers name and occupation from the marriage cert maybe we can find him on 1911 for you, if he was born prior to that of course.

We definitely have the correct marraige certificate but on their my Father is named as Patrick James ryan, on the the birth certificate it just says James Ryan.
He applied for this birth certificate in 1961 and I presume he must have thought it was his because he recognised his Mother and father, we thought his birthday was 13th January, but on this certificate it says 15th May.
As you can see it's complicated, we've tried looking on the census but can't find any trace.