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No Frederick on the 1891 but there is a Minnie Nicholls - wonder if she is M Hazel?

~~~~~~~~Waves to Dea.

Got to take daughter to hairdresser's, back in a couple of hours. Hope you have got it all sorted by then!

Sue

Sorry Blossom - haven't solved it yet !!!

What we need is another 'tack' !

Kelly - can you give us ALL the info from that marriage cert please?

Names, addresses, ages, occupations, fathers names + occupations + Witnesses!!!

Why do you believe his age is wrong and where does he claim he was born in Gloucestershire?

You give the address of where the letter came from - do you know the address it was sent to?

Thanks,

Dea x

At Ancestry, the marriage is in the name of DULCIA E ROWE, not Dulcie. I checked the image, and that is what it says.

The odd thing is that there are two entries for each spouse's name.

The first one for Dulcia goes to the page where her name appears. The second goes to a page of Taylors. The first one for Frederick goes to the page where his name appears. The second goes to a page starting with Quantrill.

I suspect this is just an Ancestry quirk, but one never knows!
(edit -- it is an Ancestry quirk. At the top of the Taylor page it says it is the result for "R" surnames, i.e. Rowe, and at the top of the Quantrill page it says it is the result for "N" surnames, i.e. Nicholls. Ancestry messed it up, added the right image results, and didn't remove the wrong ones.)


If the GRO index says DULCIA, does the certificate not say that?

And ditto to Dea -- what else the certificate says.


Had wondered whether Rowe was her birth surname for sure, but note the birth of Dulcia E Nicholls, mother Rowe, in Exeter reg dist 1926, so it appears Rowe was her birth surname.

Hi Janey,

Nice to see you again!

I had the marriage as DUNCIA E ??

Marriages Sep 1925 (>99%)
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Cook Beatrice M Smart Totnes 5b 418
Nicholls Frederick Rowe Totnes 5b 418
Rowe Duncia E Nicholls Totnes 5b 418
SMART Ernest F Cook Totnes 5b 418

We need more info here!

Dea x

Yes, but the GRO index really does have it as DULCIA. ;)

No more luck with births for that either, anyhow.

Nudge in case anyone has any good ideas!

Ethelyn seems to be a valid name as there are a few on FreeBMD, but I cannot find a birth for Duncia E, Dulcia E or Ethelyn as a first name, only Dulcie Eleanor.

There is a Dulcia Evelyn:

Births Jun 1907 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

SIMMONS Dulcia Evelyn Dartford 2a 617

and this marriage??

Marriages Sep 1912 (>99%)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Gibbons John Withers Tiverton 5b 865
Rowe Frederick Simmons Tiverton 5b 865
Simmons Eveline M Rowe Tiverton 5b 865
Withers Alice E Gibbons Tiverton 5b 865

Worth a thought???

Dea x

P.S. - Sue - does daughter's hair look good? - How old is she - is she a 'little one' , or are you as old as me (tee hee!)?

Dea x

Hi Dea - yes daughter's hair does look good! She is a litte one (8) but I had a huge gap between my son and my daughter so I'm old as well!

Well Sue,

Nice to chat while we are waiting for Kelly to come back.

I don't think you can be 'old' with an 8 year old daughter!!

My son is 'going on' 36 and I have a grand-daughter of nearly 5. + 1 year old grandson. (don't ask about him !!!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Will get back to the thread when Kelly returns.

Nice to talk!

Dea x

Nudge for Kelly.

Hello people!

Sorry to have been away - I didn't realise you were working so hard on my behalf - apologies!

I have all the info on Dulcie. It's an odd one as her birth was registered as Ethelyn Dulcie, her marriage as Dulcia Ethelyn but she was known as Dulcie! The Dulcie born in 1926 is my grandmother. She was born Dulcia Ethel Nicholls (mother's maiden name Rowe). Dulcie Senior(!) was born in 1906 (registered 1907) so she doesn't appear on any census records.

The reason we think Frederick may have lied about his age is because my nan remembers him being much older than her mother. Also, on the marriage cert, Dulcie gives her age as 21 when in actual fact she was 18. As Frederick gives his age as 29, we thought he may have lowered his age to appear more 'proper' in relation to his bride. But he may well have been telling the truth which would mean he was born 1895/1896.

Here are the details of the marriage cert:

Frederick Nicholls aged 29, occupation Bricklayer, father: William Henry Nicholls (deceased), House Builder.
Dulcia Ethelyn Rowe aged 21, father: Frederick Reed Rowe, Chauffeur

Both Frederick and Dulcie were living in Dartmouth, Devon at the time of marriage, and the date was 25th Aug 1925 and was at Totnes Registry Office. The witnesses were Percy and Elsie Chaddock. It may be that these were passers by as they're not known as members of the family. Dulcie was also newly pregnant at the time of marriage with a 7 mth old baby from a previous relationship so the wedding may well have been a rush job!!!

The letter from 'M Hazel' was presumably sent to my great grandmother in Exeter as this was where she was living at the time - haven't found the envelope. I'm currently waiting to hear from Camden local services for details on the occupants of the address at the time. I'm presuming the M Hazel is a woman as she has a different surname to her brother. The letter is a brief note enquiring about 'her' brother's health.

The problem with the census reports is that we don't know when Frederick's father died. Or even if he was dead at all by 1925! Apparently he never mentioned his father or any of his family. He said he came from the Berkeley Vale area of Gloucestershire. BUT, he was known to be a bit of a rogue so everything needs to be taken with a pinch of salt. He abandoned the family and despite being prosecuted, he abandoned them again - despite his youngest son having just died at the age of 3 of TB - nice fellow!!

Please don't bust a gut on this one - I'm not all that hopeful! But thanks for all your help so far!

Kelly x