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HOUSEHOLD HOGAN DANIEL M 1906 5 Easington Durham 1911 census
this must be what you found in 1911
susan..........can you get in to see if this is your daniel

Hi Sablon

1911 census 11 eats terrace Easington wingate
posted it earlier at 7.15 but Dea had put it on yesterday ( i missed it for some reason !!)
have been trawling Scottish BMD but nothing else coming up for Daniel birth

(first born of John and gertrudes children was also born in easington 1917)

Sue

Unfortunatly i have to go now, ooh the joys of a shared computer !!!

Thank you both for all your work today , I'm sure you will be glad to see the back of me !!!!

Sue x

susan
don't say that,
I have been stuck for 8 years looking for my ancester,brick wall after brick wall,
at last i think this wall is about to crash because of his name changing from French to English spelling.
To you and anyone else,DON'T ever give up hope,there is always a clue some where,you just have to find it

Well just 'lookey' what we have here!!!

You mentioned a marriage for a Daniel to a Sarah Ann Kay -I think this may just be the one.

Remember, on 1911 they had a 22 year old son John, so it would 'not be the thing' to say
you had only been married 15 years?

Anyway, I went looking for a Sarah Ann Kay born Wigan c 1867:

1881 England Census
about Sarah Ann Kay
Name: Sarah Ann Kay
Age: 14
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1867
Relation: Daughter
Father's Name: John
Mother's Name: Rachael
Gender: Female
Where born: Wigan, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Wigan
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street address: 28 Mc Cormick St
Education:

Employment status: View Image
Occupation: Factory Operative Cotton

Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 19
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
John Kay 50
Rachael Kay 48
Peter Kay 21
Mary Kay 19
Sarah Ann Kay 14
William Kay 12
John Thomas Kay 9

Source Citation: Class: RG11; Piece: 3765; Folio: 9; Page: 11; Line: ; GSU roll: 1341901.


Having found one, I looked to see where she was in 1891 to see if she had a 'John' with her?

1891 England Census
about Sarah A Kay
Name: Sarah A Kay
Age: 23
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1868
Relation: Boarder
Gender: Female
Where born: Wigan, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Wigan
Ecclesiastical parish: St Catherine
Town: Wigan
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England

Street address: 27, Golborne St

Occupation:

Condition as to marriage:

Education:

Employment status: View Image

Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Wigan
ED, institution, or vessel: 12
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
Joseph Allen 30 b Prescot, Lancs
Margaret Allen 26 b Durham
George T Allen 11/12
Emma Maddock 19
Sarah E Maddock 17
Noah Maddock 11
Sarah A Kay 23 b Wigan

Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 3050; Folio 101; Page 26; GSU roll: 6098160.


SHE DIDN''T !!!, but I found a John Kay of the right age, born Wigan:

1891 England Census
about John Kay
Name: John Kay
Age: 2
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1889
Relation: Grandson
Gender: Male
Where born: Lancaster; Wigan

Civil parish: Standish
Ecclesiastical parish: Standish
Town: Standish
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England



Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Standish
ED, institution, or vessel: 2
Neighbors: View others on page
Household Members: Name Age
John Kay 63 retired Flagger + Slater !!
Rachael Kay 60
William Kay 21
John Thomas Kay 18
John Kay 2 ***************** Grandson !!!!!!! - all born Wigan



Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 3045; Folio 50; Page 43; GSU roll: 6098155.

>>>>> This means John Kay is the grandson of Sarah Ann's parents, making it VERY probable
he is Sarah's son...

I think your John Hogan may very well have been registered as John KAY in Wigan
- What do you think??

I believe one of these will be him:

Births Jun 1889
Kay John Wigan 8c 32

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Births Sep 1889
Kay John Wigan 8c 1



Dea x

P.S. DON'T go sending for any certs yet !!! - I have to work on this as it could just be yet another 'red herring' !!!

Dea x

It's looking more and more possible!

Sarah Ann's brother Peter also has a son John Kay but he is a few months younger than Sarah's John (the one I believe to be Sarah's son??)

This John though is with father Peter on both 1891 and 1901 Census, aged 1 and 11 years.

This also makes it likely that the 2 birth reg I have put above are for these two John's making the earlier one Sarah's and the later one Peter's

Such fun isn't it ???

Dea x

P.S. - It might be worth looking at the details of that marriage cert for Daniel and Sarah Ann Kay to see if we can be sure we have the right people here?

Dea Xxx

well done Dea that looks very promising

Well, it's a 'possible' Sablon ???

I DO wish I could see the details on that marriage cert !!!

Dea x

I just 'have a feeling' about this one too !!! - NOT convinced though !

It DOES say 'David' on image and they are all marked as born Wigan ???

BUT - I cannot find a birth or marriage for a David which fits and he does not appear to be on any other
census ???

Often, the census details were entered later, having been copied from various bits of paper!
- It is VERY possible that Daniel could have been read as 'David' ??

1901 England Census
about John Hogan
Name: John Hogan
Age: 12
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1889
Relation: Son
Father's Name: David
Mother's Name: Sarah A
Gender: Male
Where born: Wigan, Lancashire, England

Civil parish: Pemberton
Ecclesiastical parish: St Mark
Town: Newtown
County/Island: Lancashire
Country: England



Registration district: Wigan
Sub-registration district: Pemberton
ED, institution, or vessel: 7
Neighbors: View others on page
Household schedule number: 218
Household Members: Name Age
David Hogan 39 Coal Miner Hewer.....ALL marked as born Wigan ?????
Sarah A Hogan 33
John Hogan 12


at 26 Warrington Rd.

Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 3566; Folio: 180; Page: 36.

Dea x

Look what happens when i go way for a while!! my goodness ! i'm only here for a little while, i'm actually eating my dinner as i type! then back to work .

Dea which certificate would you like?, i really don't mind, the only down side is it takes a week to come through

Hi Sue,

It's the one you found in Scotland for a Daniel marrying a Sarah Ann Kay!

If it's on Scotlandspeople, I think you actually download the cert, or the details, so it is instant ???

If this is the wrong Daniel then the above will not work but if this IS 'your' Daniel, then 'your' John fits with the John Kay birth ???

Dea x

P.S. - I DO hope I am not leading you astray here but this could be the 'key' to it all?

What do you think?

Dea x

Dea Reading what you just put,it seems like your right,seeing the cert would be best,one way or another.
and a simple mistake with david as really Daniel is all it takes.

I'm going into Scottish BMD now to try and find the certificate, (wish me luck i could be a while !!!) and see how i go about obtaining it.

I'll be back later

Fingers crossed Sue,

I DO hope I am not costing you money for nothing !!!!!!!

Dea x

Well thats odd i sent a reply ages ago not its not shown up !!! here i go again its not as good as GRO it takes 20 days to process and then you add on posting time !!

but i am quite happy to give you my details so you can see the entry for yourself. They are so much more detailed than the English, its very faint but you may be able to get a better image than me. I only have 4 credits left in case you wanted to look at anything else but its free when you have viewed something once so you could look at marriage entry as many times as you like

Let me know and i'll send you the log in details

Hi again,

That would be wonderful, if you don't mind doing it

I am really curious about this one.

Dea x

Details on here or private message ??

Sorry - had to turn computer off for a while - HUGE storm - 'thunderbolts and lightening' (yeh - mama mia etc.... (sorry if you are not of the right age to appreciate that !!).

Anyway - pm is best, otherwise everyone will have access to your account!!

Dea x

good luck susan and Dea,i keep popping in

Hi all,

Sablon - Stay with us PLEASE - We have more to do and it was you who started this in the first place - If we hadn't BOTH become 'obsessed this would never have got sorted.

Well..... - Now for the Good News.........................

This IS the correct marriage !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Image shows Daniel Hogan Coal Miner - father Daniel Hogan (Coal Miner - deceased)
mother Mary BOYLING (hard to read but we had 'Boyle or Boylan' already)

Sarah Ann Kay - father John Kay, Slater journeyman (correct!!)
mother Rachel Kay (nee Riding???? - again hard to read - needs more work!)

Witnesses Patrick Herbert + Mary Herbert !!

There you go ! - Sue's John was born as John Kay !!!!!!!!!

Can't do much till later (baby grandson to look after for the day!)

We need to work on those mothers maiden names and find the marriages but we can now get you that birth cert tto show to your half-brother, and probably much more.

Will be back as soon as I can.

WELL DONE ALL !!!!!!!

Dea Xxx