Find Ancestors

I finally found Charles(24) and Rebecca(21) in the 1841 census - they were listed as Simmons which I had tried before but this time I found them. They are in Bermondsey Buildings with a 4 yr old Charles (which would link with the 1837 birth record I found and a 2yr old Mary. Neither of these children are in the 1851 census - then it is a Louisa (9) and Harry (5). On the 1899 burial register for Charles and Rebecca in Australia their 12 children are listed with Charles listed first (dec) and Rebecca next (dec) then Emily(dec) and Alice (59), Martha (dec) Phoebe (dec), Henry (53) so Henry(Harry) seems right but Louisa still in the place where Alice is. I have not yet found BMD records for these children - any ideas where I can look please?

Yes I did post that I have gone back to my source about Rebecca Hurren to see if they have any further details about the marriage. And I did have a look at the Zachariah Simmons but that has him marrying an Elizabeth and my burial reigister for Charles has his parents listed as Zachariah and Ann Wheeler.

Did you see the Pallots entry I put above? And the possible Zac in Kent?

Just had another suggestion that Alice could be Naomi Alice born 1841 in Bermondsey - but no references given - just listed the same parents - she does get married in Australia though.

Just looked again at the Newington 1841 listing and it has a Rebecca aged 20 but no Charles it is Henry and they are in a large family of Simmonds so prob not mine at all. I am tending to lean towards the 1851 census for Camberwell as it does list Charles & Rebecca at the right age with Henry(Harry) also correct and just have to figure out Louisa who becomes Alice on the burial. I will try and find out if the marriage at Stratford le Bow links in with anything else on the Hurrens.

Ref Louisa: Going back to the Burial Register there is not a Louisa listed at all. I know they mixed their names up and called them by something else as well but wonder if I am on a wild goose chase with that name? There is a Charles Alfred Simmonds birth listed for Bermondsey bet. Oct & dec 1837 Vol v P 1. He is just listed as first born Charles deceased on the burial so can't confirm but the date fits in with the marriage. Also found an Emily Ann Simmonds in Bermondsey for 1844 Vol IV P 13 but on the burial she is listed before Alice who is 59 giving her a birthdate around 1840.

OK Looked up the Zachariah Simmons (not Simmonds) birth records as suggested. They have the mother's name as Elizabeth and mine is def listed as Ann Wheeler on their Burial register. So I guess that is a No?

Charles Alfred was written up as Alfred Charles in one Australian record. I will pay to have a look at that one you suggest to see if it links up with anything else I have scribbled down! Thanks so much.

Going from the info about a Louisa born 1842 in Newington. I did find in the 1841 census a Charles and Rebecca Simmonds in Newington both aged 20. There was no family connection with the rest of the residents. I get so confused as their names are pretty common and it iseems easy to make some tentative connections but it is proving which one is right. Thats why I was trying to find Zachariah to hopefully find the right county. The Burial registry in Beechworth for Charles & Rebecca just lists London as their place of marriage. Rebecca's parents are Isaac Hurren and Mary Morgan if that helps prove the marriage.

Try Tunbridge Wells Family History Society

Ah, found the marriage on Pallots? Is your contact sure this is the couple? It seems a long time til the first child if it is and why would they marry in East London when Rebecca is from Bermondsey and the kids are born there?

e: Rebecca Hurren
Spouse: Chas Simmonds
Marriage Date: 1837
PARISH: Stratford Le Bow St Mary

Re my thought about Zachariah being non conformist (the name is a clue) I just did a quick search on the Non parochial bmd (which arent complete) and came up with a number of children baptised in the rightish time span and in Kent with father Zachariah Simmons (no d)

Its pay to view, I dont know if its worth a punt or not. No Charles there though

http://www.bmdregisters.co.uk/bmdr/results.php?fn=Zachariah&sn=Simmonds&exact=no&event=All&all=1&all_set=1&st=s

What does your contact have a date of 1895 for?

Thats odd, going by age of eldest girl, Id have thought the marriage of Charles/Rebecca would come up on freebmd.org which covers from late 1837 but no show?

This looks like Louisa?

Births Jun 1842
SIMMONDS Louisa Newington 4 355

I have sent a request to Geoffrey who has a date of 1895 but he has not replied - as yet :)

I don't have a marriage certificate just the info that was given to me by someone doing the Hurren family.

In the 1851 census -if it is really him it says Hatter. Burial register says Gardener but at 82 and in Australia he certainly could have changed.
I was hoping that finding his father might help as the Simmonds who were hatters seemes to keep it in the family.

Clare, he is there on two trees, are you clicking on the family trees tab when you search?

Im just thinking with a name like Zac - you may want to consider non conformist records.

Whats Charles' occupation?

Who were the witnesses on the marriage cert?

How do I find the two who have a Zachariah - when I search all trees it comes back as 0.

whatever I do the only place Zac and ann show up on ancestry are 2 identical trees 14.000 strong from Australia with no sources dates or notes. I can only suggest you contact the owners and see where they got that information. They have both been active in the last week.

no need to apologise Clare - sometimes we're like greyhounds out of a trap!!!

I shall read your story and then have a lie down to think about it!!

Ann X