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Jo

Thanks for your time and effort looking.
The only other way of travelling in that time would have been horse and cart or on foot, but only good on the mainland, wouldn't get you to Tasmania.
I will keep looking he must turn up somewhere.

Thanks again
Ingrid

Ingrid

I am trying to work out other methods of travel for that time period, as I haven't been able to find my family either. How else do you think people travelled from state to state!!??
Looking at the dates you have given me, I don't beleive any of the Mr Bowers that travelled on ships could fit your description :(

Hi Jo

Thanks for looking.
They could possibly have travelled to anywhere in Australia I suspect. I have James turn up in Launceston Tasmania in 1869 when he married. Between 1851 and then I can't find him.I was hoping to find him in shipping records but so far no luck where I have looked.
I am under the impression they travelled together as they both disappear after 1851 census.
Cheers
Ingrid

Hi Ingrid,

No luck I am afraid. There are a few Mr Bowers, but none from london to hobart town (tassie)
I did find a John Bower who travelled on the Emma Eugenia in 1871 from london to hobart.
Unfortunately no Charles either. Could they have possibly travelled elsewhere?

Daddymuzza

I am sorry, I searched all the variants that I could possible think of. Nothing that seemed promising to me, but this is what I have found:

PS What was alberto's middle name?

Alberto L I Lane; Parents Alberto C O, and Mary
Died 1933 in manly
Ref: 16838/1933

Alberto C O; (father of Alberto above) Parents Charles and Selena
Died 1922 Glebe
Ref: 5121/1922

Mercel Alberto Garcia; Parents Alberto and Mary
Died 1977 location unknown
Ref: 10100/1977

Albert Edward Carr; parents unknown Died 1964 Sydney
Ref: 5767/1964

No Alberto Carr or Scaramuzzas at all. Have you seen this last name spelt any other way? I have tried to search other variants, but I couldn't find anything that looked similiar.

Jo

Hi Jo

Was wondering if you could look at shipping records 1851-1870 for
James Bowers b1838 and Charles Bowers b 1818?his father. Possibly travelling to Tasmania from England.

Cheers
Ingrid

Parents of Alberto were Enrico/Henry Scaramuzza and Maria/Mary Campelli
Only know Elisas fathers name which was Paolo Signorelli although her mother may have been named Bianca as Alberto and Elisas only child was named Bianca Maria

Daddymuzza

Do you have their parents names?

Sorry John, I think you may have missunderstood me. The CD doesn't contain all the lost records. Lost records are lost records, and just can't be found anywhere.

Looking for a death record from NSW if poss for my relatives Alberto Scaramuzza born c1891 Italy and his wife Elisa nee Signorelli
They emigrated in 1951 from London to Brisbane but before they left their surname was changed to Carr although passage records state they were named Scaramuzza
Are there any records of the death of Albert or Alberto Carr/ Scaramuzza in Nsw records

Thanx

Hi
Oz is looking less likely if the CD does contain all minus lost etc records.
Yes Lionel could be cousins as my line originates in Berwick on Tweed and some of the branches all seem to have Lionels'
Robert living in Yorkshire could have gone from various ports like Hull or Liverpool as both not too far away and as he was born in London near the Thames would have had knowledge of ships from there.
Will let you know if I find anything but don't hold your breath lol

John

The CD I have claims to have all known lists of passengers, crew, convicts and ships to and from australia. Many lists have been damaged or lost, so it may be the case like my family, that they may not be able to be found. I agree with the lionel name. How many lionel fergusons could there be unless they were from the same family?! Perhaps cousins if not the direct line. Is it possible that your robert died on board a ship whilst on the way here? Transcriber errors and illeracy have also made things difficult. Let me know what you find out, would love to hear the results from the certificate! And thankyou for the offer of uk help. I don't know if there is much left to discover. We have been stuck on our Irish immigrant forever, and I think he is destined to never be found! Cheers :)

Hi
Once again thank you

Do the cds of shipping contain all ships or are there some missing?
I have tried US and Canada as well but no one comes up that is likely.

The odd thing is the name Lionel, though not rare is slightly unusual and there seems to be a few over in Oz.
Looks like a cert purchase. Strange though if this is my mary why Robert doesn't come up as well.

Thanks

John

Ps If I can help with your research in the UK let me know.

John

Have you tried other Australian states also?

I have had a look in the shipping records, as I have the australian departures/arrivals on CD. There are a few fergusons, but none that fit your family.

Possible Death Cert for Mary Ann:

Mary Ann Ferguson D 1905 in QLD Ref: 1905/C3841
No parents listed.

Unfortunately, the certs don't have the ages on the search information, which makes it even harder! But with parents names (excluding spelling errors) it does make it easier.

I am afraid that's pretty much all I can find :(
I would suggest to maybe order that marriage cert for rose, and see what comes up. If the parents do match up, at least then you know that one of the family members migrated here, and that it's likely the others did too!

I deleted that post before by accident, but I did retype it!!
Let me know if there is anything I can still check for you!

Hi Jo
You have been busy... thank you

Middle name for Robert jnr=none
Robert snr= Harley Archer.
Mary = Mary Ann GUEST

We can dismiss any marriages prior to 1877.
Robert and Rose Ann were 15 and 12 in 1881.

The 1922 deaths are interesting as it would make Robert snr about 80, does it give age at death like UK Gro's?

The deaths of harriet and Lionel are interesting but not mine as both stayed in England and parents mentioned are not correct but the interesting thing is these 2 names are old family names. Lionel always seems to be the name given to the oldest boy.

Was it your post that got deleted? was it to me?
Would it be easier if I give you an email address?
I would be grateful if you could look up shipping records. I have searched the online ones, wellI think I have tried all.

Robert snr was on the 1878 electoral roll for Bradford so assuming that is a year old, he and Mary were still in England in 1877 and certainlt in 1876 as she gave birth in Bradford.

This may be a wild goose chase but it is all I can assume that they went abroad somewhere as I cannot find any trace on census or death records and it is strange that 2 of the 4 children disappear after 1883. I assume they sent for these?

Thanks again John

John

Would you like me to see if I can find any of this family in shipping records to Australia? Have you tried to locate them on Australian ships before?

John

Do you have full (middle) names for any of them? If I have a full name I might be more likely to find the exact person! What was mary's maiden name? Can you give me their dates of birth? Often, if parents are unknown, they include their appr. age at time of death on the certificate.

These are the possiblities for marriages in QLD and NSW

QLD
Robert Ferguson married Isabella Cuthbertson in 1862
Ref: 1862/B231
Robert Ferguson married Sarah Longmuir in 1862
Ref: 1862/C286

NSW
Robert Ferguson married Ellen Shehan Sydney in 1864
Ref: 6/1864
Robert Ferguson married Honora Sheehan in Sydney 1864
Ref: 282/1864
(I think these two are the same just transcribed differently)
Robert Ferguson married Elizabeth Howard in Mudgee in 1872
Ref: 2725/1872


I found these death certs also:
Robert Ferguson in QLD 1922 Ref 1922/F2772 No parents listed
Robert Ferguson in QLD 1922 Ref 1922/F2773 No parents listed
(I think these two again are the same)
Robert Ferguson in QLD 1922 Ref 1922/B38114 No parents listed

NSW possible death cert:
Robert J C Ferguson Died 1934 in Katoomba NSW
Parents Robert and Mary A
Ref: 21132/1934
Robert Ferguson Died 1894 in Minmi NSW
Parents Robert and Mary
Ref: 8376/1894

Possible death certs for roberts parents

Harriet Ferguson D 1912 Newtown Sydney Father: Patrick
Ref: 2776/1912

Lionel Ferguson D 1913 Moree Sydney Mother: Alice
Ref: 18597/1913

Possible death cert for rose:

Rose H Ferguson D 1921 Father Benjamin Mother Sarah in St leonards Sydney
Ref: 7217/1921.
(could be a transcribers error?)


Obtaining QLD certs are a little harder than the NSW certs.
If you go to the Queensland department of justice site, click on births deaths and marriages, then certificates, and follow the prompts. I beleive you must print off an application form and then fill it out and send it to them.
NSW certs are quite easy. Google NSW births, deaths and marriages, select the site, click on family history, then search historical indexes, and search now. You can then enter the names. You can then click on the buy now icon and follow the prompts. I have ordered most of my certs this way.
The ref numbers I have included are just the certificates recorded numbers. They don't show all details but are a great way to search multiple individuals.

Hi Jo,
Thank you so much for looking. He just seems to have disappeared!
Thanks again
Jackie

Thanks for the reply
Roberts parents........ Lionel/Harriet
Mary Ann parents ........Benjamin/Elizabeth

Rose's parents were Robert and Mary Ann
What info does the Ref you give have. Is that it?
How do I request a cert from Oz?

To explain a little Robert and Mary disappear around 1878 from Bradford, in 1881, 4 of their children are in Bradford W/house, then 2 of them inc. Rose also disappear. All I can think is the parents emigrated but where I don't know, this was a long shot but has given a little hope after 5 years. The other child was also a Robert c1867... marriage

Thanks for your help